Another religious discussion (Tconwell)

[Oscar]

Originally posted by GerstlCrazy

Ha, don't worry, no I'm not [:)]

Yes you are, bible said so.

Ah, I see that now.

It is difficult to determine the religious from the satirically religious. Your post was no more irrational than the others.

Originally posted by Coasterkidmwm

Hey tcon, it also says that if you eat anything aquatic that doesn't have scales (shrimp and lobster) you burn in hell. Don't you love picking and choosing things as you see fit?

No it doesn't.

"Eat anything that is sold in the meat market without asking questions for conscience' sake; for the earth is the Lords, and all it contains." [1 Corinthians 10:25-26]

I dont really like religion, I prefer to believe in Barack Obama...

am I the only person who doesn't like Obama on here?

So salmonella infested chicken bought on the market is fine for eatin'?

Heaven and Hell don't exist. What was life like before you were born? It's the same thing when you're dead. How do I know this?

Just believe me. I wrote a book on it.

Originally posted by Dragon Fly

It is difficult to determine the religious from the satirically religious.

I am religious, however I've discovered it's best never to force or even bring those views onto this website. I thought I'd just make a little sarcastic addition to the topic to get people fired up and prove how pointless discussing this is.

I would say no opinion will ever be changed in these discussions (aside from seeing people you once had respect for as a complete jackass) so the threads like these are pointless.

[Oscar]

Originally posted by GerstlCrazy
I would say no opinion will ever be changed in these discussions (aside from seeing people you once had respect for as a complete jackass) so the threads like these are pointless.

Why jackass? Because they share a different view point than you? Because they don't conform to your beliefs?

No because they have the attitude of a jackass.

Like you [:)]

Originally posted by Oscar

Originally posted by GerstlCrazy

Ha, don't worry, no I'm not [:)]

Yes you are, bible said so.

It's obvious who here has ever actually looked at the bible and who has not. Views of Christianity aren't restricted that tightly to the bible; an aspect that you and many others refuse to accept. Christianity as a general religion is about loving others and respecting others (this isn't completely apparent here, since the USA is the worst center representation of Christianity). That being said, there is no way that a loving, caring, and humble person could go to hell just for being gay. Love can outweigh sin (or what you believe is sin), and God is everlastingly forgiving, so I have no fear of hell at this point.

/not satire.

I feel ignored. does my opinion count?

Originally posted by CKidd

am I the only person who doesn't like Obama on here?

Nope. [;)]

Originally posted by Coasterkidmwm

When will YOU get it?

Simple thought to ponder.

IF, at the end of my life, I have lived by this faith and through that belief system it has caused me to be a better person, to respect my fellow man, and to generally be more of a humanitarian to others and I am wrong about God's Word, then at the end what will I have lost?

The answer is: Nothing. I am still dead (as some suggest).

Conversely though, IF you live your entire life believing what it is that you wish to believe and I am proven right about my faith, what will you have lost?

The answer quite possibly is: Everything.

Revelation 20:15, "If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire."

That is what I "get" Matt, cannot make it more plain and simple for you. The rest of this is pure, unadulterated ego-tripping ... hoping to make me "give up" and confess something like "I don't know". I know what I believe, and there is to be no change regardless of how insulting or rude the suggestions continue to get.

So, right on here on one of the most holiest days of the year of the Christian faith ... what are you willing to risk to find out the truth? It could be more than you bargain for.

God still loves you, and so do I.

Are you using Pascal's Wager as an argument for your position, or as a description of it?

Originally posted by TConwell
Conversely though, IF you live your entire life believing what it is that you wish to believe and I am proven right about my faith, what will you have lost?

The answer quite possibly is: Everything.
.
.
.

God still loves you, and so do I.

But, if God is so kind and all forgiving, SURELY he will be able to forgive us for not believing in our lifetime, especially, becouse a lifetime is a really small time fragment compared to the infinity of your afterlife...
Also, he might as well forgive us, becouse he didn't really leave any proof of his existance, except for a book, that was written 2000 years ago by HUMANS.

Also, if god is allmighty, why does he need so many supporters on earth?

Also, you claim Christianity is the right religion... But, every tryed to look at it from another side, from another religions viewpoint? They'll say their religion is the right one...

Originally posted by Dragon Fly

Are you using Pascal's Wager as an argument for your position, or as a description of it?

Neither Dragon Fly. I am merely using Pascal to ponder the outcome of Matt's life based on his belief system; in a more simplified format of course (for easy reading) since many here do not subscribe to Pascal's theories. To me, the lack of understanding is very much akin to Voltaire's refusal to accept the simplicity -- missing that the wager was not being used to prove anything, but to ponder and ask the reader to come to a conclusion.

The wager, however, is not a coin toss; but an opportunity to consider.

Edit:

Vid: Ephesians 2:8-9 is really wonderfully applied here: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith ????????? and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast."

I choose, by faith, to believe in Jesus Christ and the salvation that He offers to all at the cross of Calvary. Never does God say that he will just "wink at you" and forgive what you have done because He is so merciful. He gave His Son to die a horrible death so that IF we accept Christ as Savior then we too shall be saved. You must choose as well, and to not choose, is actually to choose.

[gouldy]

Originally posted by SNJ

Heaven and Hell don't exist. What was life like before you were born? It's the same thing when you're dead. How do I know this?

Just believe me. I wrote a book on it.

Nice. It is true is it not that you can make up anything you like, no matter how insane, and as long as you put it in a book that someone then reads some period of time in the future, it MUST be true! Don't you find that it's the case?

I read a book one time about a whole bunch of aliens that came down from the planet Zorgnock and turned people into frozen juice drinks, so that MUST have happened, it being in a book and all.

...

The whole argument that people who aren't religious in some form are in some way incapable of faith is a complete non-starter. Putting my faith in science simply because it has more facts and evidence to back up what it is saying to me, is not me being incapable of faith, that is me being sensible. You can put your faith into whatever you want but for me I'd rather put my faith in things that explain it's beliefs to me with real factual information with physical and tangible evidence, rather than fictional stories that any 8th grader with a grasp on latin could have written. I'll stick with science and all the technological advancements in medicine etc. it has given me, thanks to the people behind it not wasting their time being close minded and believing that everthing was created by God, instead trying to strive for the actual truth.

Pascal's Wager operates on the assumption that the correct God is chosen. Say there is a god, and it's name is Qwerty. The only way to get into Qwerty's heaven is to not believe in gods. Matt's life, or after life rather, is looking pretty good; however, you have a problem.

There are literally thousands of gods that have been conceived, and they have all shown the same lack of evidence. What if the only way to get into heaven is to make exactly 4784 posts on this website? I contend to you that you should make one more post and never again, because the consequences of not listening to me and being wrong are too grave.

If there was only one god that had ever be conceived, than the wager would be much more persuasive. The assumptions that the correct god is being chosen, and that this god arrogantly rewards belief in itself, are not valid.

Originally posted by gouldy

Originally posted by SNJ

Heaven and Hell don't exist. What was life like before you were born? It's the same thing when you're dead. How do I know this?

Just believe me. I wrote a book on it.

Nice. It is true is it not that you can make up anything you like, no matter how insane, and as long as you put it in a book that someone then reads some period of time in the future, it MUST be true! Don't you find that it's the case?

I read a book one time about a whole bunch of aliens that came down from the planet Zorgnock and turned people into frozen juice drinks, so that MUST have happened, it being in a book and all.

...

The whole argument that people who aren't religious in some form are in some way incapable of faith is a complete non-starter. Putting my faith in science simply because it has more facts and evidence to back up what it is saying to me, is not me being incapable of faith, that is me being sensible. You can put your faith into whatever you want but for me I'd rather put my faith in things that explain it's beliefs to me with real factual information with physical and tangible evidence, rather than fictional stories that any 8th grader with a grasp on latin could have written. I'll stick with science and all the technological advancements in medicine etc. it has given me, thanks to the people behind it not wasting their time being close minded and believing that everthing was created by God, instead trying to strive for the actual truth.

Wait, are you telling this to me? You know I'm in agreement with you here.

Originally posted by gouldy


The whole argument that people who aren't religious in some form are in some way incapable of faith is a complete non-starter.

I don't ever remember saying that ... but ... I am proud of you. Each of us should make a choice and stand by our convictions / beliefs / faith in whatever. I choose, Christ.

Hence, why my answer was formulated to express my beliefs in response to the sarcasm of a bone picture with the entire thread being titled as "my name". Yup, nothing personal going on there. Right?

Originally posted by Dragon Fly

Pascal's Wager operates on the assumption that the correct God is chosen. Say there is a god, and it's name is Qwerty. The only way to get into Qwerty's heaven is to not believe in gods. Matt's life, or after life rather, is looking pretty good; however, you have a problem.

There are literally thousands of gods that have been conceived, and they have all shown the same lack of evidence. What if the only way to get into heaven is to make exactly 4784 posts on this website? I contend to you that you should make one more post and never again, because the consequences of not listening to me and being wrong are too grave.

If there was only one god that had ever be conceived, than the wager would be much more persuasive. The assumptions that the correct god is being chosen, and that this god arrogantly rewards belief in itself, are not valid.

Dragon, I don't have a problem (thankfully). Re-read what I have said. The greatest thing here is that you get to choose. So choose. I was asked (again, notice the oringal name of this thread) -- and so I answered. The rest, is ......

Well, how about this for a scientific statistic: Click here

Seems to me (as just an observer) there must be some out there want to read this dusty old book, eh?

[gouldy]

Can I just say as well, I forgot to say it before, I find it slightly distasteful that this topic is entitled "Tconwell" I guess it was to get his attention in particular but still...

[Coasterkidmwm]

Originally posted by TConwell
Yup, nothing personal going on there. Right?

Yeah nothing personal like restricting others freedom based on your religion right?

I have a question, why did God do what he did to Job? He did it because another bad angel questioned Job's loyalty to God. God just to prove to this bad angel, tormented Job. Job still believed and worshipped him blindly. He questioned why he let such things happen and God gave no answer. YOu think Job would still have followed God blindly if God told him the truth that he tormented just to settle a bet with another angel?

[hyyyper]

Tcon, you say that if you live your life in your faith and you die and your god exists, you'll end up in whatever heaven. If no such things as gods exist, you have lost nothing.
I completely agree with that.
But what if the almight person is somebody from the muslim belief and totally hates christians. You'd be pretty screwed then, ey?

As for the book statistic, what does that prove?

Originally posted by Coasterkidmwm

Yeah nothing personal like restricting others freedom based on your religion right?

WOW!! I never knew I had the power to restrict someone else's freedom based on my personal religion! Hu-raah! What shall I do first?

Originally posted by Coasterkidmwm

I have a question, why did God do what he did to Job? He did it because another bad angel questioned Job's loyalty to God. God just to prove to this bad angel, tormented Job. Job still believed and worshipped him blindly. He questioned why he let such things happen and God gave no answer. YOu think Job would still have followed God blindly if God told him the truth that he tormented just to settle a bet with another angel?

Read the story again Matt -- you are missing the meaning; most especially that there was never a "bet" between God and Satan (whom you refer to as "another angel" which at this point of history is incorrect). Job questioned God to ask "Why?" - as we are each able to do (that pesky freewill thing again). However, his friends and family urged him to deny God which he never did. Job's faith remained steadfast, much like mine is during this continued barrage of nonsensical musings all while avoiding the question of what you are willing to risk to find out if I am right.

Originally posted by hyyyper

Tcon, you say that if you live your life in your faith and you die and your god exists, you'll end up in whatever heaven. If no such things as gods exist, you have lost nothing. I completely agree with that. But what if the almight person is somebody from the muslim belief and totally hates christians. You'd be pretty screwed then, ey?

I'll take my chances continuing to believe in the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Originally posted by hyyyper

As for the book statistic, what does that prove?

Well, since people love science and real numbers and stuff you can see -- there is a great stat to chew on. Seems like lots of people want to read that, what word was used earlier, "nonsense"?