2013 NoLimits Contest [results pg-4]

I'm going to have to write in on this. As one who grew up with with parents that taking us kids to amusement parks across the US, and getting to ride a lot of now defunct wooden coasters with very extreme laterals and Negative G's. Some were the Texas Cyclone which had really strong lats and neg G's, the other was the Idora park Park Wildcat and the original Mister Twister which had the entrance to the Helix which pinned you to the lap bar and slammed to the left side plus the best entry into the station which was a slam to the left and pin to lap bar. There were a few more but those were the the most outstading ones. Plus now with mostly corp. parks they really don't have the imagination for really forceful rides as there afraid of being sued. They really want to build the biggest and fastest but then they put brakes all over the ride. If you really want to see some youtube them. Here's a like of the Texas Cyclonehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuwupcpGbvM [url][/url]

The Voyage is awesome because of its lats. Its trackwork is like a newer coaster, but the great shuffling and lateral kicks it has with the PTC trains really make the ride.

Kinda sad it's getting Timberliners now.

El Toro does have laterals. They're not done in the same way as those on say Boulder Dash (and yes I've ridden both), but they are there. On El Toro the laterals are more dynamic and located at the transitions between banking, particularly during the low ending turns, whereas laterals on Boulder Dash have quicker onsets, then often sustain the strong force before suddenly dropping back to zero.

Either way, I don't think it's a great idea to take off because you like more laterals...El Toro has been ranked the top wooden coaster in the world just as Boulder Dash and Voyage have been ranked among the top. IMO, the most important thing is for a wooden coaster to do whatever it does well. El Toro doesn't have sustained strong laterals, but it does have some of the strongest airtime in the world and some powerful transitional laterals, along with very steep slopes, a huge first drop, sustained heavy positive, etc. Boulder Dash and Voyage don't have the crazy first drop or airtime that builds pressure in your head, but they do have quicker pacing, stronger and more sustained laterals, surprising transitions, and great settings. They're all still great for what they are.

It's not a huge deal, but I think trying to be as objective as possible (especially given only one judge) is for the best, and it seems to me rating coasters with sustained laterals higher than those without is a bit subjective given the real coaster rankings that show rides without these sustained laterals at the top too.

Originally posted by dcs221

El Toro does have laterals. They're not done in the same way as those on say Boulder Dash (and yes I've ridden both), but they are there. On El Toro the laterals are more dynamic and located at the transitions between banking, particularly during the low ending turns, whereas laterals on Boulder Dash have quicker onsets, then often sustain the strong force before suddenly dropping back to zero.

Oh yeah that's probably true. I haven't ridden it so I couldn't really tell, but since it's Intamin that makes sense.

I think the main concern here was whether or not they used lats in a traditional wooden coaster sense, though.

They did not. All the noticeable lats on El Toro (outside of the turn at the top of the lift) are during transitions. Toro is already a very intense ride through maybe 2/3 of the layout, so lateral forces like those on Boulder Dash aren't necessarily needed, given that the other features on the ride make it as good as it is. Same with T Express...maybe it could be more exciting to some people if it had sustained laterals on turns, but with that said...it's been one of the top 2 in the world for a while now, for good reason.

[hyyyper]

Image where it would be if it had laterals. In my opinion, El Toro has his top position due to the amount and strength of it's vertical forces. When I rode I was completely blown away by it, but I also felt it was a shame that the only laterals were from directional changes and not from underbanking turns. I think El Toro would've been the best wooden coaster in the world with a huge margin. In my personal list, El Toro is just behind Boulder Dash because that ride does offer everything I love about woodies.

Maybe that makes it too intense for some people, though. It could be the line between fun and just hanging on for your life for some. I'm sure a lot of enthusiasts would like it that way, but is it a better coaster even if only 10% of park guests enjoy it instead of say 40% now?

To me El Toro rides too much like a steel coaster to have the lats. The lats are most fun when used with shakier cars and jerkier wooden coaster track styles. I don't think it'd fit El Toro's style too much.

But yeah, just rate according to manufacturer.

so are you done with the judging and on to round 2 yet

[hyyyper]

Originally posted by highthrills2

so are you done with the judging and on to round 2 yet

Not sure if you're being sarcastic but I'll explain it again.

There will no 'official' round 2 as there are too few players who submitted a track. I do have the template which I could alter a little bit and convert it into a challenge rather than a contest.

I've written all the ratings, all I have to do is double-check them before posting.

Originally posted by hyyyper

Originally posted by highthrills2

so are you done with the judging and on to round 2 yet

Not sure if you're being sarcastic but I'll explain it again.

There will no 'official' round 2 as there are too few players who submitted a track. I do have the template which I could alter a little bit and convert it into a challenge rather than a contest.

I've written all the ratings, all I have to do is double-check them before posting.

i like to be sarcastic alot.. helps with life

i think a challenge would be good
sign me up in advance

Originally posted by hyyyper

There will no 'official' round 2 as there are too few players who submitted a track.

You people brought this upon yourselves. Everyone who downloaded the template but did not submit a track, you have yourselves to blame for making this site look a lot less active than years past. It does not take building all day 24/7 to make a good entry. Time management is key.
Wonder if a steel coaster contest would have had a bigger turnout.

I suppose it has to do more with the recurring notion that woodies submitted to the site have to have more than two months' work in order to receive a 7 rating or higher. Given that the time frame was something like a month -- and the fact that the majority of players auto-support rather than worry about the actual stability of their wooden coasters -- I think it was probably the fact that the opening round was to construct a wooden coaster.

I actually was going to submit something, but I had a confidence breakdown and dropped out. I suppose I wanted to download the contest rides more than I wanted to design them, which is probably the same reason many others didn't submit anything.

Wonder if that supporting drudgery is one reason for the 3600 feet length limit, along with making it more challenging.
Also I hope the (unofficial) round 2 template is some sort of tight fit challenge. Those are a lot of fun!

[hyyyper]

I'm sorry about the delay. There were some important (school) projects that required some work.

Ratings

Howl ????????? AmatsuNL
Track is as smooth as you can expect from Intamin, which I guess you tried to mimic. Transitions are spot on, although the entry and exit of the MCBR are quite sharp. The supports are excellent for the most part, only the turn above the station is left out of all the wonderful bracing, wide supports and reinforcements. Another odd thing I noticed was the lack of steel supports on the crossovers.
Pacing is super. By clever use of the terrain the track has two first drops, which help keep up the speed. Both the first and second halves have great combination of hills and turns, all in all a quick and exciting ride. The vertical forces are quite powerful and close to the limit of what is acceptable for wooden coasters. However, I presume that since you are mimicking an Intamin, the track and trains would be the same as El Toro/T-Express, and that the high G?????????s are acceptable. Now, the lateral forces are hard to find on this ride. Towards the end of the ride they pop up more, but it's the first part that could really use some sustained laterals to increase the overall experience.
I love how the layout is essentially split up in two parts. By dropping into the valley floor from the MCBR you get that some first drop boost for the second half of the ride. Element-wise there's not much new under the sun, but you sure know how to create those iconic Intamin turns and use then to their maximum.

Skyfall ????????? Bottom_Feeder_13
Ha! A launched RMC, that's worth a bonus point. Trackwork is smooth at first glance but there are a few sideways jolts in it. They aren?????????t that rough that it would hurt or anything, but it's definitely noticeable. Supports aren?????????t very good. You did create steel horizontal beams and steel structures in places, but the track needs far more supports, especially in (high) corners.
The ride is quite intense, the launch into the zero-G is a great first element, followed by an huge drop next to the valley wall. Back on the top of the plateau the speed is maintained through all the low elements. For the finale, you plunge into the valley once again. While this increases the speed again, the final is rather short. Perhaps placing some elements from the plateau into the valley would have allowed you to take those at a higher speed. Forces are excellent, maybe not always on the limits, but everything?????????s there for sure. Perfect floater in the zero-G and plenty of airtime on the hills. It's a shame the laterals appear so late during the ride, the first half has some turns that are quite tame without laterals.
The layout is very basic. You use the walls of the valley well to create two kick-ass drops, but the finale is very simple and looks rushed. The middle of the ride on the plateau has some nice turns they are mostly variations of the same turn and that's about it. Like the finale, it could've been spiced up with some really twisty bits of track. The zero-G roll and the following drop are awesome, but that level isn't continued throughout the ride, which is a shame for a ride which such a great opening.
This was also the only ride that failed the E-stop test. When the E-stop is pressed during the launch, there is a chance the train rolls back with such a speed it cannot be braked and will crash into the station.

Suou ????????? COZY_N
Trackwork is quite good. It is very smooth and all but the transition of the final hill flow well. I think a lot of the transitions could've tighter/faster/snappy-er as they are quite drawn out. Expect the final hills, that one is just too sharp. Supports are not much of an improvement on the standard generated structure. It seems like this is because of an imminent deadline as the diagonal bracing on the lift looks pretty good. The high placement of the track doesn't make it easy or cheap to support either.
While the ride has a very high speed, it's hard to notice. The elements are very drawn out and the transitions are far from quick. This results quite a boring ride, even though the speed is very high. You also didn't go all the way to the bottom of the valley, which would increase the speed of the ride and give you the opportunity to increase the excitement by going low to the ground. The positive vertical forces are good, but the ride is lacking airtime and lateral forces. There is mostly floater airtime on the hills, which is too low for a real quality ride. I do not know if you kept the laterals low intentionally, but laterals add so much to a wooden coaster, it's really a shame you kept this ride so tame. The long turns could've been more exiting if there were some good laterals on them.
The layout of this ride isn't great. The ride features long straight sections that are connected by massive turns. I liked the right-left turn going under the first drop and the downwards spiral over the lake. For the rest aren?????????t that many interesting elements. The sections above the valley are incredibly high, which might give the ride a massive look (see White Cyclone) but it doesn't help the ride experience.

Ghost in the Woods ????????? highthrills2
The track has lots of jolts and pumps. The transitions are far from gradual and the banking is not smooth. If you take a ride in the last car, you can see the train jumping and jolts all over the place. You should try to go gradually from one radius to another and keep the amount of banking per time or per distance as constant as possible, or at least prevent sudden changes in banking. Fast and quick transitions are good, but they should have a proper entry and exit to fit correctly to the sections before and after. The supports are far from adequate. If you look at coasters of this size (Ravine Flyer or Hades) you?????????ll see that there is additional bracing and wide structures all around the track. To really get the supports down, you?????????ll have to do more than just use the wooden support generator.
I like the beginning of the ride, the small drop into the tunnel and then you open up with a view of the valley while passing under the drop into the valley. As for the main portion of the ride, it could've been better. You only used the valley for one drop. The hills are too high, which results in the train crawling over the hills. Placing trim brakes did not do you any favors either. The finale is nice, it has lots of head choppers and directional changes, which was lacking in the first portions of the ride. The vertical forces are too high for such a wooden coaster. +4.4 G is very uncomfortable. The laterals are alright, although I'm not sure that what you intended or the result of bad track work. Airtime is either very low or nonexistent on most hills, again because of the slow speed.
Like I said in the previous section, the prelift gives you a nice view of the valley, but other than the second drop, you aren?????????t using the terrain to your advantage. The only interesting bit comes near the finale, that's the kind of twistiness you?????????d want during the entire ride. The other sections are too slow or too basic to provide any innovation.

Iron Rod ????????? PandaTJ32
I love the Iron-Rattler kind of freestyle that this ride seems to be, but there are many problems with the track. It seems that half of the transitions are very bad while the other half is actually good, I'm not sure if you got lucky on those one or there's another reason. But the bottom line is that the track is full of pumps because of the abrupt changes in radius and banking. You should try to make the segments flow into each other so that it's impossible to notice where one segments starts and the other begins. The supports are just a hair better than having no supports at all. The wooden support generator gives only a baseline which you can extend with bracing and wider structures. Take a look at real coasters that resemble your ride and try to mimic or blend real structures into suitable supports for your rides.
The flow of this track has its ups and downs. The massive drop into the valley, as well as the second one later on is super, but the large following it is not. They are incredibly huge and monotone, so they are boring and costing you a lot of track distance that could've been used for other elements. The inversion back up into the plateau is a little too slow in my opinion. The floater is good, but the twist needs to be faster. All in all, the ride is very short and the valley?????????s potential isn't fully used. Because of the bad track work there are lots of G-spikes that would be very uncomfortable. The amount of airtime is extremely limited.
The layout starts out great with a plunge into the valley, which is later followed by another drop into the valley. However, both drops are followed by two dreadfully long turns before going up the plateau again. The stuff that happens on the plateau is fun, the barrel roll and high-banked turns fit will within the layout and in strong contrast to what?????????s happening on the valley floor. If you could've made those long turns into something more twisty and thrilling the ride would feel far more complete.

Feral Scream ????????? SkyArrow
Overall a smooth track, there are some minor jolts in a few of the transitions. I'm not sure what tools you used, but it seems like your switching quite abruptly which creates the tiniest of jolts on the track. Supports are alright. The wide structure is good in most places but is very sloppy at the high-level turn-arounds.
The ride starts out great with a massive double down into the valley. Then the pacing sort of halts. The train is far from slow or crawling, but it's doing anything sensational. The occasional head chopper keeps things slightly interesting, but you really have to wait for the pacing to pick up once you drop down the valley once again. The forces are spot on. Airtime isn't excessive and the positives are well within the comfortable limit. Laterals are fantastic, especially on the moments where they are sustained trough an every curve or bend.
The part of the ride that takes place on the plateau and the cliff sides is awesome. It has awesome drops, including the epic double down, and lots of twisty bits. The turns on the valley floor are very big and because they are so constant they are really boring. They also take up a lot of track length, which in turn could've been used for more twisty bits.

Wooden Warrior ????????? Coasterdave
Perfect trackwork, the transitions are very smooth, but there are some that are too drawn out. The track could use a little more throw-and-hurling and a little less controlled. The supports on the hills and bridges are good, but there are no wide structures on the turns at all, those things would topple during the first test run.
Ha! This ride is ridiculous, but then in a good way. The way you put the drop of the 2nd hill all the way down to the valley is quite a surprise for guest who will expect the entry and exit of the hill to be on the same level. The first pass over the river is cool, but the passage back is almost identical. Drawn out as those speed hills, one is ok, but the second one is boring. If you had added a twist, a double-hill or crossover would?????????ve helped a lot. The twisty parts at the far end of the layout and in the finale are good, but they are overshadowed by the long straight sections. The drop into the valley coming for the turnaround is awesome, the tunnel halfway down the double down and the head chopper boosts the adrenaline. The vertical forces are excellent, powerful positives and plenty of airtime. Laterals are very low and this ride has very few turns to begin with, it's shame those turns don't have some nice laterals.
I could only find two flaws in your layout. While the ride is a classic out and back it really needs a tad more twisty bits. The second thing is that the passes over the river are very drawn out, which is ok if it's just one hill, but having two hills of the same shape and them being that long is really repetitive. Basically anything else than a second speed hill would?????????ve been a huge improvement. But the rest of the layout is fantastic. I already said that postponing the drop into the valley to the second hill is incredible. The tunneled double down on the way back is just as awesome. The rest of the layout is very twisty and every single piece (except one) fits perfectly.

Scores





Congrats to AmatsuNL (sorry for the confusion Coasterdave) and thanks to everybody who participated. I'll post the challenge round this weekend and hopefully this will have been the last official NL1 contest on this site.

Originally posted by hyyyper

The turns on the valley floor are very big and because they are so constant they are really boring. They also take up a lot of track length, which in turn could've been used for more twisty bits.

I kinda felt that way too but I left it in because it was visually appealing, and also because of the speed. Also I did not use any tools if that's what you're wondering. It's all hand-built.

Originally posted by hyyyper
hopefully this will have been the last official NL1 contest on this site.

Hopefully? You hope there are no more contests? Or do you envision future contests involving No Limits 2? [:D] This was a fun contest and all but I think a steel coaster contest would have been more fun. I would have liked to have more players in, tho.
The top three tracks were pretty much what I expected, but not necessarily in the same order (I kinda expected AmatsuNL to win). Nevermind, he did. Congrats (sorry Coasterdave). Have you since changed my mind since claiming my entry to be better? At least you weren't overconfident.

Originally posted by hyyyper

I'll post the challenge round this weekend

[:D]

[GavG]

Hyyper you may want to look at your jpeg with values as you have given coasterdave a 13 in a column that has a total of 10? This would make coasterdave 2nd place not first if them 3 points are removed.

Should this RMC coaster of mine have been entered instead of the newtony Wooden Warrier coaster? Image Insert:

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Originally posted by cool5

Should this RMC coaster of mine have been entered instead of the newtony Wooden Warrier coaster? Image Insert:

112.86 KB

No, I'd rather it have been entered in addition to it, since that would have been another player to add to the roster.

hahaha, I only realized how foolish of me it was to build that turnaround directly above the station when I was already done. The contest was really fun though. [:D]

[hyyyper]

Originally posted by GavG

Hyyper you may want to look at your jpeg with values as you have given coasterdave a 13 in a column that has a total of 10? This would make coasterdave 2nd place not first if them 3 points are removed.

Crap you are totally right. I thought I had double-checked everything.
Thanks for noticing.

I think sometime eventually I might make a sequel to my entry that will use the same template but attempt to be bigger and/or better, and it's possible I may not restrict myself to a max length of 3600 feet, but not now.

Originally posted by NightwindElf

Originally posted by Kevincoaster300

Im doing it right now. actually in the first 30 minutes I got a smooth layout(not complete) with just under 3.0 g's

You have an entire layout in 30 minutes? I'm still shaping my drop. I would suggest that you double check EVERYTHING.

So.... He said that is NOT COMPLETE don't you read?

[mkingy]

Thread's a bit old