Cedar Point 2016- Valravn

[TTD03]

This reminds me heavily of Griffon, with the pure difference being the inversion vs the splash down. This would win with ease, but if the restraints suck like GateKeeper, I think Griffon will be the winner for me.

People set way to high expectations for Cedar Point, they simply can't build the worlds best coaster everytime and you people would probably still complain. This ride does everything the park needs right now. Its drop will probably be the second best in the park after millies, the immelman is the second tallest inversion in the world(I think), only behind gatekeeper, the second drop will have some really nice airtime, dive loop(First time ever on a dive machine), mavericks lost barrel roll finally returns, and an actual airtime hill. Plus if you look in the rendering, the marina entrance is in fact being updated and the blustreak area isn't so out of place anymore. I'm pretty sure they can't actually dig deep enough for a tunnel so being disapointed about that is stupid, people always complain about CP coasters being parking lot coasters, but guess what, that whole penisula is naturally flat. Theres nothing they can do. The midway visuals for this are going to be amazing. Virtually the entire ride is over the midway.

While, to me, this ride is a disappointment for many core reasons, that POV animation is freaking gorgeous. The quality is really high and looks real at some points.

^My sentiments exactly. Especially the first 4 or so seconds looking out of the station. Plus, the enormous dive coaster track looks beautiful in 3ds Max

[Paradox]

I mean the coaster itself is okay, but this does not fit into Cedar Point at all. Like if this went to a smaller CF park like Vallefyair then it would've been a much greater addition. This coaster and its design seems like a rushed project.

It's nice to know that CoasterCrazy exists so I can voice my opinion without fear of being attacked by Robb Alvey and his group of lunatics.

Honestly I don't care what other people think about the ride, less line for me. But seriously, come up with a valid reason why cedar fair, the people who actually know what they're doing, have made a bad decision and what a better possibility is that's not just a self entitled coaster enthusiast reason.

^It's not about Cedar Fair at all for me. It's nearly impossible for a B&M to be a bad financial decision for any company.

It's about my excitement to ride it, which is at the same level as Gatekeeper. Let the "meh" B&Ms draw the lines away from the coasters I really want to ride like Maverick and TTD. I'm fine with that.

I'm sure it will be a fun ride. But not one I would plan a trip around like Taron or Lightning Rod, not even close.

It will add nicely to their line up though.

As for theming or special features? I wasn't expecting them. It's Cedar Fair. They are as dry as the desert when it comes to that stuff.

[Dirk_Ermen]

^Pretty much what he said.
It's probably a fun ride but I'm mostly disappointed by the layout. It may the the tallest Dive Machine out of them all, but it barely does more than Griffon. From the looks of it, the biggest momentum gets killed on the MCBR. Shouldn't be too hard to add one more element before the MCBR to make the layout a little more interesting as well?

[mkingy]

I think its a fair argument as an enthusiast to be continually pushing for better and better rides from parks. I doubt the general GP from Ohio know that Taron is being built and how awesome that is much like no GP in the UK has heard of boulder dash. If we just settled for "pretty decent ride, GP will like it" I'm not convinced we'd have as many top quality rides across the world.

Dirk_Ermen wrote:

Shouldn't be too hard to add one more element before the MCBR to make the layout a little more interesting as well?

Actually it would be pretty hard, you'd have to remove the other car ride as well for anything to fit.

mkingy wrote:

I think its a fair argument as an enthusiast to be continually pushing for better and better rides from parks. I doubt the general GP from Ohio know that Taron is being built and how awesome that is much like no GP in the UK has heard of boulder dash. If we just settled for "pretty decent ride, GP will like it" I'm not convinced we'd have as many top quality rides across the world.

Well, then explain how Thunderbird, which is praised on here, is better than this. This is more than a decent ride, this is a world class ride that's being dwarved by the fact its near the very best coasters.

CP cares about pleasing the 99% of the people who go to their parks.

What enthusiasts see:

- Dive Machine
- Nothing "new"

What GP sees:

OMG THAT THING HOLDS YOU AT THE TOP AND DROPS YOU STRAIGHT DOWN?!?!
WHAT?!?! LOOK AT THAT GIANT LOOP! YAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

I think CP cares more about the latter.

Also, Dive Machines are awesome. You are all complaining.

CoasterGuy2000 wrote:

mkingy wrote:

I think its a fair argument as an enthusiast to be continually pushing for better and better rides from parks. I doubt the general GP from Ohio know that Taron is being built and how awesome that is much like no GP in the UK has heard of boulder dash. If we just settled for "pretty decent ride, GP will like it" I'm not convinced we'd have as many top quality rides across the world.

Well, then explain how Thunderbird, which is praised on here, is better than this. This is more than a decent ride, this is a world class ride that's being dwarved by the fact its near the very best coasters.

Well, the launch of course, the pacing, decent forces and nice theming. Not to say that Valravn is mediocre at all, just explaining why Thunderbird is a pretty good B&M haha . I wish they had done something else with the first half instead of the "drop, immelman, MCBR" combo on the hyper-dives but the second half is easily the best of all the dive coasters.
By the way, to back up the fact that Valravn is being hyped a lot by the GP (which is the actual demographic parks care about), the Valravn animation on my channel has the most views of any 2016 coaster animation I posted (which really isn't saying much haha ) , surpassing even Lightning Rod's view total (which took a month to achieve) in only 2 days. The GP is gonna love this.

B&M evolve in subtle ways, and mostly too slowly for my liking, but they are evolving. Like it or not, the Gen-II OTSRs I imagine will be employed for any inverting coaster here on out, until hopefully they eliminate OTSRs entirely. The fact is, Valravn's layout is the best of any dive coaster to date but people are failing to acknowledge that simply because it's similar to what came before...or perhaps more importantly due to lack of expectation management.

I would have loved to see B&M move from their comfort zone more, but I still appreciate the refinements to the Griffon-Sheikra formula on Valravn. It's the only dive coaster with a dive loop, and the only full sized model with an airtime hill or zero G roll. I find it interesting that the Joker coaster has basically the exact same element (a zero G roll with a highly banked leadout into a downward helix) and in the context of the RMC coaster the element is praised as a gem of Shilke originality but on the B&M coaster it all bleeds into the amalgam of 'meh' that people project. It's all about perspective, and while even I'll concede that the Valravn seems to fall short of delivering as complete a package as the Busch pair, I think it absolutely has a more complete layout and will end up delivering the best ride.

As a side note, I don't know why Cedar Point didn't publicize Valravn's teaser trailer which appeared during the actual announcement that featured a Raven flying past the Point's existing coasters and then making a vertical dive as the coaster train fell. I think that would have helped to convey a bit more excitement.

The ride looks good! The first "half" (more like first 1/3) looks like your standard Large Dive Machine, but I like how the thing goes all Krake / Baron at the end with the 0G roll and air hill. Really nice and solid layout!

aj74205 wrote:

I find it interesting that the Joker coaster has basically the exact same element (a zero G roll with a highly banked leadout into a downward helix) and in the context of the RMC coaster the element is praised as a gem of Shilke originality but on the B&M coaster it all bleeds into the amalgam of 'meh' that people project.

I agree; somehow when B&M makes a 91-degree wave turn on a giga coaster virtually everyone passes it off as an unoriginal, forceless "Boring & Mediocre" element, but when RMC does so much as add a turn on a coaster everyone thinks it's the most groundbreaking idea that's ever been conceived since the airplane.

[Coasterkidmwm]

aj74205 wrote:

I would have loved to see B&M move from their comfort zone more,

They don't do well when they're totally forced into things, case and point being Hydra.

Hmm...

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[Paradox]

Valrvan is actually going to Canada's Wonderland and CP is getting a restaurant instead. #Priorities.

Hopefully that you're telling jokes.

[mkingy]

Backwards facing trains.

[Mr. Freeze]

That would be awesome and kinda awkward at the same time

Tony Clark is teasing us again.

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Thought that note said "Rongarou". That's gonna be stuck in my head from now on. Yeah, Dive Coasters are about the drop. I was not disappointed when it was released. I was all like "Oh, look! Awesome drop coaster that does some other stuff!" It's an intense people eater and thats what CP needs. A coaster that won't have a 9 hour line on a Saturday haha.

[mkingy]

Who is RNC

[Mr. Freeze]

good question