Suggestions to redo the rating system

Originally posted by IntaminFan397

Originally posted by IntaminFan397

Math question:

With our current rating system, what is the maximum amount of possibilites we can rate a coaster, in combination of adrenaline, originality, and technical?

Just repeating that since it didn't look like I was actually asking a question. Could someone figure this out? I'm really curious about it and I don't know how to figure it out.

Possible unique combinations: 20 * 20 * 20 == 8000
Unqiue Scores: 60 possible totals for averaging, so 60

Thanks Tyler.


8,000 unique combinations... a little much don't you think? Do we really need to rate tracks that precisely?

8000 isn't that many really. There are almost that many tracks here.

I agree that the rating system is a little extravagent actually. I think it leaves a lot to personal opinion, which leads to complaints such as those seen recently. I do like the "out of ten" ratings though. Perhaps just make it an overall rating, rather than categories, like Tylers site. Although i dont know whether that would fix much.

I like the rating system on Tyler's site (its the same on Coasters2k also), but I think a perfect rating system would be one rating out of 10 in .25 intervals.

[Blade]

In stead of giving a rating for the technical, originality and adrenaline you could give a ranking witch would just give a rating. You can do this 2 ways. 1 way is to rank witch would give the default rating and the other way you could just rate witch would give the rank.

I agree with dropping originality. All it has done is forced some ridiculous standards among designs. I dont think the "realistic" and "fantasy" mean anything anymore. Realistic should mean realistic, wether the element order is new or not. If its realistic, it fits the bill.

But as he said (and Im one of those Shivering Timbers fanatics) there are some rides that are super unoriginal but deliver thrills far beyond any other "original" ride.


People need to start looking at the BT and the Adrenaline. Ya know what? I could care less how original any ride is. If it delivers what it intends too (wooden coasters would mean lats and air and steels lots of G's in both directions with lower laterals) then its a winner. So what if its got the same layout pattern as another ride, does it execute it better? Does it have more adrenaline?


Im ALL in favor of taking out originality. That should influence the score as a whole, not just one section.

I disagree, i really really really dont want to put this in but..., with the growing popularity of ...'tools' (sigh) the building technique of a coaster realy doesnt account for anything anymore. I feel that Originality is one of the real places that shines, sure your points are valied above Real, but i love to see someone do something unique really use there creativity and there minds to put together something that hasnt been done before, which in todays world of No Limits is getting harder to do. The originality of a ride is one of the things that makes rides so unique and different for me. If we didnt have originality, we wouldn't have Nemesis

Edge, when a signifigant portion of the user population is using them, AND USING THEM WELL, I'll agree with you.

Exactly. 99% of the tracks uploaded just are severely technically flawed. I sometimes have to be a bit generous because even rides that most people consider smooth do not even deserve a high rating in technical. Actually, I'm not going to be as generous anymore... Every ride that I rate now I will give a completely honest technical score, and it will cause a lot of complaints, but people are really taking off little points in BT more often now, and below average coasters are getting great ratings. I could name a few coasters that have had tools used that they don't help technical really all that much. Actually, I could name many. Only a couple people use them well.

I think most very original rides just have stupid layouts. Giving people higher points in originality just because they have a completely original layout EVEN if its stupid is like adding points for the ride being worse! How ridiculous. Again, originality shouldnt be removed altogether, it should be REPLACED with "Layout".

[Brtnboarder495]

Yea originality just seems to be a free buffer category. I never see a low originality rating - a coaster with a 6 in technical, 7 in adrenaline and 8 oringinality gives it a 7 rather than an 8. I really think that there should only be one category for rating and the rater could just include their own deductions typed out in their own rate, seeing as everyone seems to have their own format anyway. I do believe that if we went along with the system I just explained, there should be increments of .10 out of 10.

ill be honset here, i havent read a single ones opinion on this except for the first 5 posts.

My idea:

Make it so that if someone (aka noobs) rates like crap 5 times, they are bannened for a month. If they rate like crap 5 more times, they are gone for good.

I don't think that they should be banned from the site, but from rating. Banning them from the site when theres a more simple solution is a bit harsh, don't you think?

Perhaps a better idea would be to require approval to rate? Basically make it a semi-automatic thing where if you post/have a certain number of files with, say, 7+ scores, you get rating privileges. Also have the ability for mods to add people who show intelligence in the forum, etc. From what I see, it's a pretty small core group of maybe 30-40 people that post 95%+ of the good ratings anyway.

not really, im like the government. i see the problem, and i want to kill it.

Originally posted by The Edge

If we didnt have originality, we wouldn't have Nemesis

Not true. Nemesis isnt truely original. Given what restraints they had to work with, its actually TYPICAL. They had very little height to work with and their only option was to go underground.

Originally posted by The Edge
I disagree, i really really really dont want to put this in but..., with the growing popularity of ...'tools' (sigh) the building technique of a coaster realy doesnt account for anything anymore.

Eh. How many times must you guys here that a ride has to be nearly perfect to begin with in order for these to be as good as they can be?

Originally posted by The Edge
The originality of a ride is one of the things that makes rides so unique and different for me.

I agree, however then I feel your view on what makes a good ride good is skewed. How good would nemesis be if it was an SLC, rough and crappy? How good would it be if it were by B&M, but built like the newer models lacking the same force and whip?


I think what truely makes Nemesis a standout design isnt the layout, its the way its executed. You can take any ride that rides awesome and transplant it anywhere else and itll still get GOOD reviews. Maybe not as good, but good. Now if you take a ride that relies on themeing and its a crap ride but themeing is good, if you take away that themeing, its going to be a crap ride.


Nemesis isnt original. When you look at the circumstances it was built under, its totally typical. In this industry whenever you force a company into a tiny corner like that, they do amazing things.


I think the real rides that shine are the ones that without themeing, without something wild, give you a ride that is unlike anything else. That ride will stand out far more than any other ride normally because the actual riding portion will leave a lasting impression on you.



I didnt remember much about Dueling Dragons themeing. Sure, Castle is great. But I did remember how smooth and how freaking intense it was.


Like Shivering Timbers: One of the most unoriginal rides to date, yet, delivers one of the most amazing rides in the world. It cant be made worse than it is if you dont change the layout. However, if you sunk the track down 50ft, it would be AMAZING with all the tunnels and such. But even all above ground, its still an amazing design. The ride that can stand alone and still be amazing is an original ride. Think about it.

I feel the exact same way as Real does. I never, ever, see rides as being a better coaster because of theming. Timber Terror is one of, if not my favorite coaster. Why? Because it has the most incredible airtime I've experienced before and is just furious from beginning to end. It has no theming, and it sure doesn't need any. Like Real said, theming would only add to the coaster, it wouldn't make the coaster.

Originally posted by Tyler

Edge, when a signifigant portion of the user population is using them, AND USING THEM WELL, I'll agree with you.

Here, Here [:D]

[bockzilla]

OK, here is my 2 cents worth on this topic:

The rating system is just fine the way it is. As I state in almost all of my coasters that I have uploaded...

If you feel like rating this coaster, then by all means do so. I appreciate any constructive comments (good or bad) as they will help me design/recreate better coasters.

I really mean this. I have had bad ratings on some of my coasters and I have not once complained about them. Other people have complained about low ratings on my coasters. I really don't care. It is one person's opinion and they have a right to it. That opinion has more significance if it is well explained. If it is not, then the designer or anyone else has a right to post a complaint and have it reviewed by the admins. Their decision should be final. If I feel the need to contact someone about their rating of my coaster I do so personally. I ask for clarification on their rating or try to explain my side of things. If they don't want to change it that is fine with me at least I had my say too.

Well, that is my 2 cent worth.

Woah, so let me see if i understand you, Real. Are you saying that Nemesis isn't a stand-out ride, just one that is nicely themed? To bring in my own personal viewpoint, are you kidding.

I haven't ridden a lot of coasters in comparison to, i guess, a lot of the others here. But i would say that nemesis is one of the best roller coasters in the world, and it's not because of patriotism, or short-sightedness, or anything like that.

Yes the ride is nicely themed, and it does add to the experience, but i would not say it is the experience. Nor would i say that nemesis is typical of B&M given the circumstances. The fact of the matter is that i enjoyed nemesis because it is a surprisingly intense. I remeber the first time i got off it i was actually dizzy and disoriented. I vividly remember my feet slowly being prised from my legs through the turns. I could not tell you the exact layout, or sketch it, despite having ridden the ride more times than i can count.

I know that i'm not going to turn you around on this, but i still feel that originality is something of an important factor. Maybe that is to specific for this site however, because as you say, some of the best rides in the world are completely unoriginal. All i'm saying is i feel that we can not disreguard originality completely.

Actually, I did say that what makes Nemesis so great is because its typical of the Old B&M's - Intense. As i tried to illustrate, if the ride was weak, you could still have all of that amazing scenery and it would just be a mediocre ride. We see that happening today with rides being built that look promising, but lack in the department of force.

Seems you missed my point, because thats exactly what it was. Nemesis is typical in that it was forced to be different. However, because its both different and intense is what makes it such a great ride. Not solely because its original.



Also you guys, you need to understand Im not saying that originality has no part in a ride, it just shouldnt be weighted as much as it is. the fact that its as heavy as all the other factors is absurd. We dont judge rides in real life like that, why do it here? Also many people judge originality purely on elements alone. Why not judge on the way the elements are taken? Maybe theres a different twist, an odd entrance or exit to an element? I could make a Loop - Dive Loop - Zero G - Cobra Roll ride be totally original but because those core elements are in that order, its not original.

To me, thats where originality goes to far. It makes up too much and is too broad.

Plus the way people rate around here, I could make a VERY original ride, but if the ride is weak and not smooth, the originality will be very low because people will give all ratings an overall low rating.

Ok, fair enough, sorry i misunderstood, i thought you were trying to say that Nemesis wasn't original. Other than that, i agree that for a lot of people, the categories don't bear much significance. This is why i suggested a single rating as opposed to many categories.

I did say it also wasnt original. The old B&M's were exactly like that, very powerful. Almost every old B&M stands out alone because of that. Look at the Batman clones. Aside from some of them having the police cars and stuff (which most are gone now) the ride still gets top reviews because of its ride, not the themeing.

My point was that given the circumstance, Nemesis is typical. There were so many tight restrictions in order to make that ride that it had to be original based on the criteria. In that way, its typical. A truely original ride would be one thats not under a huge set of criteria and still pulls off a ride that is unique and more importantly has the ride to back it up.

The ride should be the underlying factor in every rate. however, it seems now that originality is. I am reluctant to release my rides because I like to take whats out there now and do something different but use the same stuff. Now its like if you dont have a quadruple-twisting-dive-loop-snake dive in your ride, you get lower than 5.

Originality is TOO weighted. It needs less weight because people mistake originality for purely being new elements.

I see what your saying Real, about Nemesis. I also agree with it. For those that don't understand, (I think) this is what Real is saying simplified:

Nemesis IS original. Its original because it HAS to be original to fit in with the terrain, restrictions, etc... And because of these, Nemesis' layout has to be at LEAST the originality that it is. Its forced to be at least the originality it is, but with the restrictions considered, its still a typical B&M ride.

There ya go. I said that, just under all of my other ramblings, got lost.